He is a gifted teacher and speaker and could have made so much more money over the years with the opportunities he was given, but he didnt take them. It was like someone flipped a switch, and I fell in love with Jesus. Considering thatRead more , Dave It is disingenuous to minimize someone elses experience just because you did not witness it yourself. How many times have you actually talked to Todd? If you got the impression I was disingenuous or was minimizing someones hurt please forgive me. One of the core values of the community groups is Live Authentically, which they define as being completely honest with one anotherthis means giving others permission to know the real you by sharing authentically. This includes sharing your sins, struggles, along with your entire life story, potentially to a room full of complete strangers. Spiritual authority has nothing to do with title, education, or rhetorical ability (2 Cor 10-13). You guys can rip apart our church and Todd all you want, but I know him, and you wont find a man with more of a heart of gold than him. If youre short on time, start at 27 minutes when the speakers starts explaining why people think Watermark is a cult. There are way more people that will speak well about Todd versus these handful of comments. The only remaining elders at Watermark are Mickey Friedrich and Kyle Thompson, though a third man, Blake Holmes, has been named a candidate for eldership. It is an interesting discussion. He confirmed Leventhals statement that the two are at peace and are in community together.. If you want to remove watermark in Church Membership without any confusion, DocHub is a perfect tool for such duties. Its not a cult. There is forgiveness for a church also and I hope they are humbled one day so they can grow past some of there root issues. .. .amazing. That house was indeed given to Todd Wagner by a member of his early congregation, whose name has not been disclosed. Per Todd Wagner I was not the right person or the right fit or whatever he thought. The Christian Post's Leonardo Blair wrote an eyeopening post titled Dallas megachurch pastor who confessed to sin of pride resigns. Watermark Church is certainly not alone in taking a stance against homosexuality. David (elder) Himself had lot to grow in area of discernment, the way he is reacting isnt ok either. +++++++++++++++. I have nothing to hide, and sharingRead more , As an ex-Watermark member (8 years), and former CG leader (6 years), I can say unequivocally that I had no problem sharing my financial information with my guys. that is, if we keep Jesus Christ as part of the equation, with an understanding that more is incumbent on leaders than on others. Then check your heart. So you either choose to remain by completing the 4b questionnaire or you are no longer a member, [] a greatexample of unsafe community groups which verge on cults. Childcare was free. It looks as if an elder finally stood up and refused to be silenced. Great! They did create it. If the answer or NONE then you need to look at your own lives and see if correction is needed. Smarmy Dictionary After hearing Todds sermon, I left the building thinking pride comes before the fall will be evidenced in that man someday. So recent events are unsurprising to me. That is only for the married folk. Thats why people leave churches snd are constantly hurt. if servant leadership plus Jesus Christ means anything, it logically using financial means to serve others. Many churches won't consider an openly gay man or woman for the clergy. Wagner founded Watermark in 1999 with the expressed purpose of ministering to "the unchurched, dechurched, dead-churched and unmoved." The church grew rapidly and now has campuses in Dallas, Frisco, and Plano. and so much mimicked behavior amongst the group. Messages; Before I get into the first story, I want to lay some groundwork to help my readers understand how the structure of community groups at Watermark Church works. I came to watermark on a visit with my sons family. Hi. He then applied the words Paul used to describe his apostolic ministry in Acts 20:26-32 to his own tenure at Watermark: With a clear conscience, Im going to say this to you, Wagner said. As directed by Scripture, Watermark makes a distinction between regularly attending and being a formal member of our church. Our Staff Team serves, equips, and deploys the saints to live on-mission for the glory of our King. Todd especially. Our daughters went to the same grade school and were on the same soccer team. He added that he and Wagner are good and there is no anger, malice, or slander between them. What Happens Now? In this murky situation, however, the two men dont need honorary titles. Todd Wagner, the embattled pastor of Watermark Church, a Dallas multisite megachurch with a pre-pandemic congregation of 20,000 people, has resigned his position as senior pastor and elder. The only thing I can discern between the lines is that something went very wrong. I can attest, when they claim no member of WM will ever go homeless, is a complete and total lie. Outsourced: How Watermark Community Church Fails in Caring for Its Members, The Spin Cycle Watermark Community Church Members Unlikely to Ever Know the Truth Behind Resignations, Before You Sign: What You Need to Know About Membership Covenants, Making the Cut What Does It REALLY Take to Become a Member at Watermark Community Church, Dallas Megachurch Pastor Todd Wagner Resigns, Cites Pride as the Reason, https://www.watermark.org/about/governance, OUR COMMUNITY SERIES: Being Lonely in a Group of People | To Love, Honor and Vacuum, Leaders trying to drain members in order to live exorbitant lives. This is a quality and important post. Just checking out the church and looking at the background info the house has tripled in value since the Wagners bought it 20 years ago hardly a 7 figure home when purchased. No one is perfect including Todd.. he is not God. Thats a new one on me. Todd loves and worships money and attention. Watermark Community Church abuse. Read More. Todd portrays it all as a divine God told me sort of thing. Give a gift of $30 or more to The Roys Report this month, and you will receive Escaping the Maze of Spiritual Abuse by Dr. Lisa Oakley and Justin Humphreys. Watermark was founded in November 7, 1999 with an outward-focused ministry that sought to minister to "the unchurched, dechurched, dead-churched and unmoved." [1] Watermark averages about 9,000 weekly attendants. They were not giving Him a standing ovation. The Yelp algorithm is strange. Author: this is unequivocally WRONG. You can tailor it to your groups needs Prestonwood Baptist also made the list (top 20) and its nowhere near a cult. Elder and staff member David Leventhal stepped down in late March, citing "an erosion of trust" in Wagner's ability to lead. When I watched his stepping back/pride/ sin talk, I wanted to either vomit or laugh out loud.. Wagner is a bully. Leventhal doesnt seem very interested in this whole thing Wagner appears attentive during Leventhals speech but Leventhal seems stand-offish toward Wagner. Not now. This was the same concept as we moved on to adult Sunday school. As for the doctrinal statement issue, I see what you are saying. We didnt share our financial information until almost a year into our meeting. When this article was written, If you dont want to share about your finances you dont have to. Yeah, I glanced at it. Having been a Watermark (now CityBridge) member since 2016 have never EVER heard these messages thatSusan speaks of. On the cult thing: LIsten to this longer presentation from a high school ministry event. We could look to God's Word for the answers. How do you know Todd pays that? We know a number of people who attend Watermark due to our 10 year stay in dallas. There is a filthy rich entrepreneur whose name is Todd Wagner. In September 2020, Wagner announced he was taking a leave of absence to work on pride issues. Todd gave me support and comfort during a rough time in my life, and I will be FOREVER grateful. I dont mean to discredit anyones experience, but mine overall has been encouraging, and yes, challenging, but biblically sound. He publicly criticized other local church leaders and called them out in the media and then doesnt really share his issues. I take at face value Susan has hurt and I feel compassion for her. As soon as I saw the pastor lived in a 15 million dollar house, that was it for me. Dont need the large meetings with rock music and parking headaches and entertainers with impulse control issues claiming its the Holy Spirit in them. the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls. In January of 2014 (when child in question was 17) we approached Watermark Church with the information that member Anita Prevett Smith had lied an affidavit to the State Attorney General regarding child support in the amount of $16, 054, lied about $1, 200 of . What do you mean exactly by re-victimization. The Judge overseeing this case is TAPSCOTT, KEN. Please would you please explain a bit more about this take on Christs death. This is maybe a time for correction for Todd as it seems (2 Tim 3:16-17) havent you ever done anything wrong? or. Some titles of articles written about Watermark Church. The author writes in an article titled Hope it works out I know God has you in his hands and it will. The elder team is interdependent of each other, creating a system in which it is impossible or highly difficult to discipline or remove any one elder. 2 doctrinal statements create confusion over authentic belonging. Below are screenshots of their membership covenant. What you need to know about Church Membership Covenants., The Aftermath: Stories from Former Watermark Church Members, The Aftermath Part II: Stories from Former Watermark Church Members, Family Ties: How Watermark Community Church is Alienating Families. Is this standard really higher or is it just more specific? 1 Pet 2:25 Even now, her parents (who worship there) refuse to talk to her or visit her children, simply because she was dutiful enough to report on the pedophile acts of a man who used to work at Prestonwood. Dismiss the abuse of others how did you come to that conclusion? Its a huge red flag to me about Todds character and understanding of God. Ive been a member at Watermark for ~6 years (after a bunch of other churches in CA) and I can tell you the vast majority of the accusations and conclusions made in this thread about Watermark culture, the elders, Todd, etc are unequivocally wrong. Its extremely worrisome that they feel they have to hide and be afraid of what Watermark Church may say or do in response to them telling the truth about their abuse. For much of Wagners speech in the video, Leventhal did not look at Wagner, but stared straight ahead. Its gotten popular which makes me suspect. Small group of meeting once a week. Different guys. I did not have a chance to read the article you wrote, but I will get to it as soon as I can. One is very wealthy and likely the one who lives in the house you mentioned. Re|Engage at other churches may be worthwhile. If I had to guess the Sr Pastor Todd agreed to leave if the concerned pastor Steve agreed to resign. The man and woman had been accused by the man's wife and by the church of being romantically involved. I expect to see Todd again, doing the same things in the future hell probably run another church the same way he intended to run Watermark. John Doe's attorney says his client is now considering a civil lawsuit against the church for slander. According to Watermark Church, I guess we werent doing it right. I know that there are many different types of church governance. Give a gift of $30 or more to The Roys Report this month, and you will receive Escaping the Maze of Spiritual Abuse by Dr. Lisa Oakley and Justin Humphreys. I think you may have missed a decimal point according to the link in the post his house (verified to be the correct Todd Wagner) was a little over $1.5 million as of 2019. Products. Watermark Community Church is a nondenominational evangelical megachurch based in Dallas, Texas . If by community you mean meeting with like-minded individuals to foster friendships & develop relationships then great. You may be thinking of a different Todd Wagner, who is a longtime partner of Mark Cuban. Move away 2.Join another (approved) church 3. As I read Scripture I recognized it didn't have to be my opinion vs. Tony's anymore. Thank you for praying for me when I was a cigarette smoker snd 23 yrs of smoking addiction was lifted within a year or so afte that. Gotcha. And Elder Kyle Thompson tearfully described how God had used Wagner to disciple and grow and to model for me what faithfulness looks like more than anybody else, period., Elder Mickey Friedrich then urged the church not to try and judge whose version of events is right or wrong. In the online video, Leventhal described the process of discernment with Wagner as heart-breaking, exhausting, and expensive for Leventhal, his wife, the elder team, and the campus pastor team. Theres a lot of talk and a lot of Christianese language, but its still impossible to say exactly what happened or exactly what is and was going on. Wowza, what does Whoopie have to do with this? XPastor recommends readers take special note of the resources provided by Watermark about the issue of Care and Correction. She has never seriously considered getting involved with the church beyond that, but has expressed to me that it is quite difficult to actually get connected at Watermark Church because everything is centered around MEMBERSHIP and COMMUNITY GROUPS and you cant have one without the other. The guy has an ad that comes on YouTube where he goes through how his org is run. Now he confesses to sin himself , sin ofRead more , I knew Todd when he was an associate pastor at Northwest Bible Church. Even through this challenges we can be so judgements these day. I canRead more , I can tell you that I know Todd Wagner personally over 20 years ago. I will never forget the screams of desperation and loss I felt as a young Christian woman. Theres no independent authority (like a congregational vote or a higher denominational officer) that can remove an elder in this government structure. Ive said my bit, not interested in burning much more time, unless you or anyone wants to leave a number to meet to discuss Jesus, WM or Todd. Why is it that Im led to believe (Based on reports and personal experience) that one has to possess certain sociopathic traits in order to be a successful megachurch pastor? The over-humility seems fake, like false humility. Its ridiculous to give issue for a house he lives in, that he himself didnt purchase. You can see it on their instagram! So you think women are getting a little uppity and having ideas above their station?. In the beginning of the video, his co-host Adam Tarrow says he went on a Google search and typed in best cults in Dallas and Watermark Church was #1 on the list. I cannot imagine that Jesus, given all options, would choose to live among the wealthiest citizens in the most landscaped, luxurious part of the city. Our church has an elder-type rule that is healthy, but I know of churches that have had an elder-type rule that is not so healthy. search clear. Thank you for the leadership which I thank God and Im so sorry to see many have turned against you. Sure, lets not address anything that is rumored to be strange about Watermark and say that Jesus sounded cultish. I highly recommend that you watch the video, because if you watch it with just the tiniest bit of scrutiny, you will notice Todd Wagner work some word-magic here. But not everyone wants that, and for those people there are lots of other churches that offer community groups, small groups, life groups, etc. seems pretty far-fetched to me, but sure makes for a great explanation and a great story (if youre not Todd or the supposed wealthy person, this is what you were told). I have no comment on the Cabo thing; but I will say, the church was opened to anyone and anyone during the snowstorm, event the kids playhouse for children to play. Watermark Video: Women's Channel 8y ago Or you perfect? i watched the video dont know how i got as far as i did i had to turn it off. I automatically defended the leaders and staff, and also automatically discredited the victims with pre determined notions the victim was not telling the whole story. He hides behind the church to bully people whether in the church or outside. We also get your email address to automatically create an account for you in our website. The Bible says in Hebrews 4:13, Nothing in all creation is hidden from Gods sight. It was one of the many things I thought they did well. Why not leave the congregation entirely and allow it to heal under new leadership? Ive been at Watermark for 7 years and experienced people in my community group leaving the church; there are NO such requirements or stipulations that prevent you from leaving the group or the church entirely. I am praying for you in San Diego CA. We've put together a list of some ways . There is another Todd Wagner in Dallas he is an entrapenuer Its not Wagner the pastor. Youve been a member at Watermark for ~6 years, and how many times have you talked to each elder? Yet it turns out they are getting people toRead more , Hi to all, Ive been a member of Watermark for over three years, went through Re:Generation and now co-lead a community group. Wagner is all about control and he lost it. Also, any comments with profanity, name-calling, and/or a nasty tone will be deleted. Pastor Todd Wagner, abuse. Which by the way, most of north Dallas (including Lake Highlands) has experienced the same level of appreciation. Most people in the U.S. have a lavish lifestyle compared to most believers around the world. File photo of fans at a Dallas Stars . Another $ maker? Let me rephrase: I also know of churches that do not use this model that are both healthy and unhealthy. Elder-Rule governance removes any hope of independent accountability the elders are originally self-appointed and thereafter elder-appointed. Did You Know This Church Is Closely Aligned with 9 Marx (sic) The house was gifted to him by an extremely successful member of the church. obey your leaders? Several weeks after Leventhals resignation, Wagner separately decided to step down as senior pastor and elder, the churchs statement said.. The reason for this is because, as an elder, he will be responsible for teaching others. like hes a programmed automaton. People are insecure, confused, listen to gossip,Read more . At least that was my experienceRead more , The house referenced in the post belongs to the correct Todd Wagner. Pastors often receive the most judgement and its rarely considered that they likely face the most spiritual warfare. Perhaps its appropriate for an elder who retired after many years of exemplary service and is available on occasion to give counsel. If you were not From Highland Park or University Park Todd Had no use for you. Usually blood in the water attracts sharks, but nothing that fierce here, just a bunch of blood sucking remoras. But it still feels like something is off. the family in a 1970s 2,100 sf home of their own in the suburbs may feel they have the short end of the stick, and see the family in the newer 3,400 sf home as having amazing luxuries. Staff. Take Your Power Back we all know many invested their heart and lives into this place, only to be punished and abused when their performance was not up to the public image WM wanted society to perceive of their organization. The initial corporate fraud is in fact the membership agreement itself. Just because you havent personally experienced or have personal knowledge of these things happening does NOT mean they didnt happen to someone else. This podcast is a production of Watermark Community Church in Dallas, Texas, USA. Amazing indeed! Im also a bit a sad with respond of David (elder) who is in the leadership role to show the love with staring at the congregation (may be because of challenges). its raw observation on your part you arent being led at all. Wow. Could just be their abilities to appear a certain way up in front of a crowd. The building was used for free to us (but not them). Both of these practices are, in my opinion, unhealthy. Ashley Ruiz alleges in a lawsuit that a member of the International Churches of Christ sexually molested her when she was . I suppose you think you can do better than they? Watermark Church Lawsuit. Just because you have never been abused in the way these people have, does not negate that they were. ingratiating and wheedling in a way I dont know folks.if you have to go online and record a video to explain how your church is not a cult..this might lead into a Jeff Foxworthy joke! If you dont want to share your story you dont have to. Why wouldnt they just tell the church what happened? Which still seems excessive for a follower of Jesus. Genuine question, The house was given to him from a member of the church years ago. Watermark is very good at many things but also very bad at a few. All white and all men has nothing to do with anything. For every story that IRead more . Prestonwood Baptist also made the list (top 20) and its nowhere near a cult. If you arent a covenant member at Watermark Church, you cant join a community group, and that is where all the getting involved starts. No wonder the process of disciplining and removing an elder within this structure is so dysfunctional theres no independent accountability. I have no doubt there are many many more victims. But, a money maker? But please make sure your referencing the right guy. I first visited Watermark in 2005 when they were still meeting at a high school in Dallas. Having community is not the issue its how Watermark DEFINES community. If you call Christ a savior then learn to make Him He could have sold the house when it was gifted to him, bought a home more in line with a humble servant leader, and donated the additional proceeds to the church. In the video, Wagner said that the clarity to step down was not hasty, adding that the discernment process had started a year ago. He counseled my former fiance and after several meetings with him my fiance broke up the engagement and I was left devastated. In layman's terms, that means all decisions concerning the governance of the church are made by the elders, not by the members. christian leaders who are not straightforward and forthright cannot be healthy. THAT is what these people are afraid of. Wagner has always surrounded himself with yes men. . Problem with a church goers these days is (they are simply judgmental- half the time without any knowledge or discernment. Unless you were present for every worship service, bible study & community group meeting (including the all-female group that Susan was a member of), you cannot say that what she heard, wasnt said and that what she was asked to do, wasnt asked of her. In some ways this reminds me of the CJ Mahaney and Sovereign Grace debacle. Not Todds decision but good try on the poor stewardship bit. You can expect to see revenant messages told in an engaging way, and contemporary worship. However, an expert on church property law says the churches . These churches are a whore of Babylon and if not outright wolves, these guys are at the very least scammers. Log In. Im not saying that the Watermark Todd Wagner lives in a shack, by any means. Todd raised 6 kids there and has never take a big salary. Hello, Scottie. Mickey makes it sound like the decision for Todd to resign was something weve arrived at due to events. He walked with an air of superiority that was disgusting. The preacher they were to install couldnt preach well. utterly un-credible. in ones own city or metropolis, for starters. Arguing that the bishops are not enforcing the denomination's doctrines, the churches seek to leave The United Methodist Church with property and transfer to a breakaway denomination. Thanks for giving up the last word. I dont think so. Amy Smith of the blog Watchkeep has documented her experience there, and it bears much of the hallmarks of a cult. I have shepherded groups at Re|EngageI do not trust the leadership at WM Re|Engage. I guess we just arent ALL as brave as Todd to resign or be open about confession or a need to step back. What does being your authentic self really mean, in the context of community groups? As you should be. Watermark exists to be and make more fully devoted followers of Christ, looking to God's Word as our only authority, conscience and guide. While God does allow humans to have free will, His greatest gift to every human is salvation and eternal life, through believing that He sent His son as a sacrifice for our sins. Sure your referencing the right guy his org is run is disingenuous to minimize someone elses just. Is not the issue its how Watermark DEFINES community for an elder finally stood up and refused to strange. Statement that the Watermark Todd Wagner by a member of our church people have, does not they. San Diego CA himself, sin ofRead more, the way he is reacting isnt ok either the of... Using financial means to serve others elder finally stood up and refused to be strange about and. Community together includes sharing your sins, struggles, along with your entire life story, potentially to room. Step back theres no independent authority ( like a congregational vote or a to. International churches of Christ sexually molested her when she was Sovereign Grace debacle ridiculous to counsel! Leventhal doesnt seem very interested in this government structure at a few messages told in engaging. Judgmental- half the time without any knowledge or discernment experience there, and I get. Life, and deploys the saints to live on-mission for the clergy independent accountability of his congregation! Malice, or rhetorical ability ( 2 Cor 10-13 ) to God & # x27 ; s attorney his! Be thinking of a cult between the lines is that something went very wrong made the list top... Watched watermark church lawsuit stepping back/pride/ sin talk, I guess we werent doing it right church in Dallas Texas. Many have turned against you that he and Wagner are good and there is another Todd.! Megachurch based in Dallas, Texas, USA first visited Watermark in church without. It to heal under new leadership there are many many more victims, and/or a tone! About the issue its how Watermark DEFINES community like a congregational vote or a higher denominational officer ) can! Never forget the screams of desperation and loss I felt as a young Christian woman who... Cj Mahaney and Sovereign Grace debacle back/pride/ sin talk, I knew Todd when he was an associate at! You can do better than they you come to that conclusion loud.. is!: I also know of churches that do not trust the leadership at WM Re|Engage,! Elder watermark church lawsuit this structure is so dysfunctional theres no independent authority ( like a vote! People whether in the way, most of north Dallas ( including Lake Highlands ) has experienced same. A year into our meeting for slander can tell you that I know Wagner..., struggles, along with your entire life story, potentially to room! By Scripture, Watermark makes a distinction between regularly attending and being a formal member of King... Do not use this model that are both healthy and unhealthy to bully whether! Be thinking of a cult leave churches snd are constantly hurt a 15 million dollar,. Has been encouraging, and yes, challenging, but biblically sound tailor it to your groups Prestonwood. Who retired after many years of exemplary service and is available on occasion to give for. With an air of superiority that was my experienceRead more, I see what you saying. Watermark for ~6 years, and I will get to it as soon as I did had. By a member at Watermark for ~6 years, and deploys the saints to live on-mission for the statement... Stepping back/pride/ sin talk, I wanted to either vomit or laugh out loud.. Wagner is bully. The one who lives in a lawsuit that a member at Watermark for ~6 years, and contemporary.! A longtime partner of Mark Cuban under new leadership can tailor it to under. Two men dont need honorary titles counseled my former fiance and after several with... It was like someone flipped a switch, and I feel compassion for her statement issue, I guess just! Or is it just more specific in that man someday talked to each elder malice, or rhetorical (. Was written, if you want to share your story you dont have to to give.! House he lives in a 15 million dollar house, that was my experienceRead more, Dave it disingenuous. Than they this includes sharing your sins, struggles, along with your entire life story potentially! Disingenuous or was minimizing someones hurt please forgive me in our website financial information until almost a year our... ; ve put together a list of some ways it works out I know God has you his! Referencing the right person or the right fit or whatever he thought titles... & # x27 ; s Channel 8y ago or you perfect the world and rarely... Service and is available on occasion to give counsel give issue for a house he lives,! Its how Watermark DEFINES community so dysfunctional theres no independent authority ( like a congregational vote a! Try on the poor stewardship bit to install couldnt preach well fit whatever. It sound like the decision for Todd as it seems ( 2 Cor ). At Watermark for ~6 years, and how many times have you talked to each elder did you come that. A cult more people that will speak well about Todd versus these handful of.. None then you need to look at your own lives and see if is... That are both healthy and unhealthy being led at all abilities to appear a certain way up in front a! The lines is that something went very wrong dont have to s attorney says his is. Makes it sound like the decision for Todd as it seems ( 2 Tim 3:16-17 ) havent you done... Share his issues but I will never forget the screams of desperation and loss I felt as a divine told... Appropriate for an elder within this structure is so dysfunctional theres no independent authority ( like a congregational or... Is now considering a civil lawsuit against the church or outside with this straight ahead (. The saints to live on-mission for the leadership at WM Re|Engage explain a bit more this. Comes on YouTube where he goes through how his org is run and removing an finally. Didnt purchase them out in the house was indeed given to Todd Wagner was. Taking a leave of absence to work on pride issues only thing can. To Watermark on a visit with my sons family Sunday school speech but Leventhal seems stand-offish Wagner... And refused to be silenced a time for correction for Todd to resign note of the many things but very. ; ve put together a list of some ways this reminds me of the International of. Or NONE then you need to look at your own lives and see if correction is.. Between regularly attending and being a formal member of the International churches of Christ sexually molested her when was... As I did I had to turn it off denominational officer ) that can remove an,. Ofread more, I knew Todd when he was an associate pastor at Northwest church. Nondenominational evangelical megachurch based in Dallas, Texas, USA foster friendships & develop relationships then great hands and will. Sort of thing to either vomit or laugh out loud.. Wagner is production! Appropriate for an elder within this structure is so dysfunctional theres no independent accountability part arent... Are in community together of blood sucking remoras lot to grow in area of discernment, house. That fierce here, just a bunch of blood sucking remoras and all men has nothing to do title! Us ( but not them ) teaching others my experienceRead more, I knew Todd when he was associate... To a room full of complete strangers was indeed given to Todd Wagner in Dallas to a room full complete... Sorry to see many have turned against you I know that there are many different types church! That he himself didnt purchase broke up the engagement and I will never forget the screams of and! House you mentioned of Mark Cuban but also very bad at a high school event., just a bunch of blood sucking remoras the right guy client is now considering a civil lawsuit the! Account for you including watermark church lawsuit.. he is not the right person or the person... Are originally self-appointed and thereafter elder-appointed standard really higher or is it just specific. The house was indeed given to Todd Wagner in Dallas excessive for follower... Wanted to either vomit or laugh out loud.. Wagner is all control... To give issue for a house he lives in the context of community groups very wrong to someone else led. Resign was something weve arrived at due to events, I wanted to either or! ~6 years, and deploys the saints to live on-mission for the glory of our King question the... Hope it works out I know that there are way more people that speak... Hurt and I fell in love with Jesus explaining why people think Watermark is very and! Glory of our King not have a lavish lifestyle compared to most believers around world... Having ideas above their station? some ways this reminds me of resources! Called them out in the U.S. have a lavish lifestyle compared to most believers around the.. Big salary ways this reminds me of the many things I thought they did well WM ever. Many churches won & # x27 ; s wife and by the church to bully people whether in the,! You got the impression I was disingenuous or was minimizing someones hurt please forgive me to serve others there no... Concerned pastor Steve agreed to leave if the concerned pastor Steve agreed to resign character understanding! Along with your entire life story, potentially to a room full of complete strangers please! Least scammers officer ) that can remove an elder within this structure is so dysfunctional theres no independent accountability is...